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post #4561 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 10:23 AM
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Sometimes when there are lines in the picture, e.g. blinds or a striped shirt there is movement in the lines instead of just seeing the normal stripe of the line. Is this normal?
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post #4562 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 10:27 AM
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I'm finally getting some time to set up my 75z9f that was delivered during the holidays. Before bothering the group, I was waiting on new high-speed certified Monoprice Premium HDMI cables, which I finally got. My setup is as follows:

Sony 75z9f
Denon AVR-x4400H
DirecTV Genie 2 / Genie Mini 4K
AppleTV 4K
other non-4K relevant devices

I've replaced ALL my HDMI cables with the Monoprice Certified Premium High-speed Cables which claim to support 4K/60 / HDR / DV / 4:4:4.

My issue is that when I go to my AppleTV 4K (running latest TVOS), I can only get the AppleTV (wired thru the Denon 4400) to work at HDR 60Hz. When I try Dolby Vision at 60hz or 50hz it will not sync, but 1080p DV at 60 Hz and 50Hz works. Also, I cannot get chroma 4:2:2 to work either, only 4:2:0.

Any tips?

Thanks in advance.
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post #4563 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pesh115 View Post
I'm finally getting some time to set up my 75z9f that was delivered during the holidays. Before bothering the group, I was waiting on new high-speed certified Monoprice Premium HDMI cables, which I finally got. My setup is as follows:

Sony 75z9f
Denon AVR-x4400H
DirecTV Genie 2 / Genie Mini 4K
AppleTV 4K
other non-4K relevant devices

I've replaced ALL my HDMI cables with the Monoprice Certified Premium High-speed Cables which claim to support 4K/60 / HDR / DV / 4:4:4.

My issue is that when I go to my AppleTV 4K (running latest TVOS), I can only get the AppleTV (wired thru the Denon 4400) to work at HDR 60Hz. When I try Dolby Vision at 60hz or 50hz it will not sync, but 1080p DV at 60 Hz and 50Hz works. Also, I cannot get chroma 4:2:2 to work either, only 4:2:0.

Any tips?

Thanks in advance.
My first thought would be to try swapping cables. Just because they are new and certified doesn't mean they couldn't be possibly bad. Second thing you can try if the first doesn't make a difference, is to try a different input on the AVR. If that doesn't do anything try going direct to the TV. Other than that, I don't have any of the listed devices so no experience any of the options or nuances of their behaviours.
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post #4564 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pesh115 View Post
I'm finally getting some time to set up my 75z9f that was delivered during the holidays. Before bothering the group, I was waiting on new high-speed certified Monoprice Premium HDMI cables, which I finally got. My setup is as follows:

Sony 75z9f
Denon AVR-x4400H
DirecTV Genie 2 / Genie Mini 4K
AppleTV 4K
other non-4K relevant devices

I've replaced ALL my HDMI cables with the Monoprice Certified Premium High-speed Cables which claim to support 4K/60 / HDR / DV / 4:4:4.

My issue is that when I go to my AppleTV 4K (running latest TVOS), I can only get the AppleTV (wired thru the Denon 4400) to work at HDR 60Hz. When I try Dolby Vision at 60hz or 50hz it will not sync, but 1080p DV at 60 Hz and 50Hz works. Also, I cannot get chroma 4:2:2 to work either, only 4:2:0.

Any tips?

Thanks in advance.
I have an ATV 4K as well, running through a Marantz, and don’t have the same issues. I am also using the same cables. Next step would be to bypass the Denon and go directly to the TV to see if this fixes the issue. And, of course, there could be a cable issue, although I have always had good luck with Monoprice cables.
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post #4565 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenmann View Post
Sometimes when there are lines in the picture, e.g. blinds or a striped shirt there is movement in the lines instead of just seeing the normal stripe of the line. Is this normal?
That is normal and is due to Motion Interpolation making an error. You can simply turn Smoothing to min or off if that is a major problem to you.
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post #4566 of 4724 Old 01-04-2019, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pesh115 View Post
I'm finally getting some time to set up my 75z9f that was delivered during the holidays. Before bothering the group, I was waiting on new high-speed certified Monoprice Premium HDMI cables, which I finally got. My setup is as follows:



Sony 75z9f

Denon AVR-x4400H

DirecTV Genie 2 / Genie Mini 4K

AppleTV 4K

other non-4K relevant devices



I've replaced ALL my HDMI cables with the Monoprice Certified Premium High-speed Cables which claim to support 4K/60 / HDR / DV / 4:4:4.



My issue is that when I go to my AppleTV 4K (running latest TVOS), I can only get the AppleTV (wired thru the Denon 4400) to work at HDR 60Hz. When I try Dolby Vision at 60hz or 50hz it will not sync, but 1080p DV at 60 Hz and 50Hz works. Also, I cannot get chroma 4:2:2 to work either, only 4:2:0.



Any tips?



Thanks in advance.


Did you enable enhanced HDMI on the Sony for that input?


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SONY Z9F LCD Master Series Owners Thread
Vizio 2016 P series FAQ, general info and Help
Sony Z9F 75, Vizio P75C1 UHD/HDR/DV, Pioneer Elite SC-95, Samsung UHD Bluray K8500, AppleTV 4K, CC Ultra
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post #4567 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 10:17 AM
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It might be interesting for someone ...


youtube . com / watch?v=DikkMagcuE0
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post #4568 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 11:04 AM
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So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
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post #4569 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isingh View Post
So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
No disrespect, but there has been considerable discussion earlier in this thread, and there is even a dedicated Z9D vs. Z9F thread.
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post #4570 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by isingh View Post
So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
No disrespect, but there has been considerable discussion earlier in this thread, and there is even a dedicated Z9D vs. Z9F thread.
No problem, I understand your thoughts. I have been digging into threads. I will keep looking. and I just hoped to get some feedback on after using for sometime if they changed their opinions.
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post #4571 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 02:26 PM
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I don't believe they are building any more Z9Ds after this last build anyway so whatever is out there is probably going to be the last.
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post #4572 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isingh View Post
So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
In short. ZD9 is best for critical movie watching in all other areas the ZF9 is best, especially for Gaming/PC-Monitor and Sports. Q9FN is in my opinion inferior and unsatisfactory in many important but hard catch ways until you use it critically for a bit, but it's quite okay for a low price.

ZF9 wins against Q9FN when it comes to Gaming and as Monitor:
+ Gaming, low input of lag 22ms vs ZD9 of 27ms in 4K and 40ms ish in all other resolutions. Q9FN is equally good in this regard.
+ Up scaling is very good in Cinema mode and uses an alternate but very Sharp one for PC/Game mode. Best I've seen, and I've owned both Q9FN and Q900.
+ Does true sRGB at Chroma 4:4:4, some thing Samsung can't do at all.
+ Motion is very good on ZF9, Both the interpolation for Cinema but also the backlight strobing is better. With Q9FN you get double images when panning background in games or double mouse cursors in windows due to poor backlight implementation of 120hz outside of movie mode.

ZF9 again wins against ZD9 when it comes to critical gaming due to lower input lag and has great HDR performance with the cleanest and most uniform VA panel I've seen but will lose out against ZD9 when it comes to watching movies straight on and handling on blooming, in SRD it's not a big issue but in HDR you can def see blooming in letter box movies. Q9FN does fare much better in blooming vs ZF9 and is probably okay vs ZD9 ut Samsungs dimming algorithm unnecessarily overly dims regions in side content compared to ZF9 and vingeting edges and letterboxes. Q9FN image is not accurate but can be pretty.

Edit: The reason I went with ZF9 after trying out Q9FN is mostly due to Sony offering a more accurate picture in ALL regards:
+ low input lag
+ very natural and accurate colors (sRGB and accurate saturation, not like Q9FN default over saturation)
+ dimming (no black crushing small dark regions)
+ much sharper scaling (sharper)
+ gradient and noise handling, you can set the amount of noise and banding reduction individually on Sony, Samsung bakes these together and doesn't handle either noise of banding artifacts as well as Sony does.
+ Q9FN has smearing of details in motion in very dark regions. ZF9 is excellent.
+ motion (industry leader in interpolation)
+ backlight flicker (no double images), viewing angles (no off angle raised gamma of dark regions)
+ panel uniformity (Q9 has banding issues).

Last edited by JoelArt; 01-05-2019 at 03:15 PM.
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post #4573 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Well whenever I have a WiFi issue a reboot the device first and if that doesn't work I reboot the router. Those are always my first two steps. Seems logical to me.

I'm using Ethernet to the TV so I don't have any run time with WiFi on it.

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After rebooting the router, I am able to connect the TV to WiFi again. Let’s see if it stays connected, or if it drops off again.
This happened to me once. I held down the TV remote power button for about ten seconds. The TV rebooted and reconnected. Wi-Fi hasn't dropped since.
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post #4574 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 04:41 PM
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Thank you for your detailed explanation. This is very helpful.

What do you guys think about the video posted for brightness comparison of several panels including q9f , Z9D etc.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zwb92Jxdhb0

I am not the expert, based on this video at least q9f appears better ?





Quote:
Originally Posted by JoelArt View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by isingh View Post
So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
In short. ZD9 is best for critical movie watching in all other areas the ZF9 is best, especially for Gaming/PC-Monitor and Sports. Q9FN is in my opinion inferior and unsatisfactory in many important but hard catch ways until you use it critically for a bit, but it's quite okay for a low price.

ZF9 wins against Q9FN when it comes to Gaming and as Monitor:
+ Gaming, low input of lag 22ms vs ZD9 of 27ms in 4K and 40ms ish in all other resolutions. Q9FN is equally good in this regard.
+ Up scaling is very good in Cinema mode and uses an alternate but very Sharp one for PC/Game mode. Best I've seen, and I've owned both Q9FN and Q900.
+ Does true sRGB at Chroma 4:4:4, some thing Samsung can't do at all.
+ Motion is very good on ZF9, Both the interpolation for Cinema but also the backlight strobing is better. With Q9FN you get double images when panning background in games or double mouse cursors in windows due to poor backlight implementation of 120hz outside of movie mode.

ZF9 again wins against ZD9 when it comes to critical gaming due to lower input lag and has great HDR performance with the cleanest and most uniform VA panel I've seen but will lose out against ZD9 when it comes to watching movies straight on and handling on blooming, in SRD it's not a big issue but in HDR you can def see blooming in letter box movies. Q9FN does fare much better in blooming vs ZF9 and is probably okay vs ZD9 ut Samsungs dimming algorithm unnecessarily overly dims regions in side content compared to ZF9 and vingeting edges and letterboxes. Q9FN image is not accurate but can be pretty.

Edit: The reason I went with ZF9 after trying out Q9FN is mostly due to Sony offering a more accurate picture in ALL regards:
+ low input lag
+ very natural and accurate colors (sRGB and accurate saturation, not like Q9FN default over saturation)
+ dimming (no black crushing small dark regions)
+ much sharper scaling (sharper)
+ gradient and noise handling, you can set the amount of noise and banding reduction individually on Sony, Samsung bakes these together and doesn't handle either noise of banding artifacts as well as Sony does.
+ Q9FN has smearing of details in motion in very dark regions. ZF9 is excellent.
+ motion (industry leader in interpolation)
+ backlight flicker (no double images), viewing angles (no off angle raised gamma of dark regions)
+ panel uniformity (Q9 has banding issues).
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post #4575 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isingh View Post
Thank you for your detailed explanation. This is very helpful.

What do you guys think about the video posted for brightness comparison of several panels including q9f , Z9D etc.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zwb92Jxdhb0

I am not the expert, based on this video at least q9f appears better ?
It's very important to understand that most videos and photos including the youtube one exaggerates blooming and black levels. I doesn't look nearly as bad in real life. Yes Q9FN has good black but they are achieved at the expense of image accuracy due to overly aggressive dimming, if you manage to enable Cal Day/Night through the Service menu and/or have it professionally calibrated I believe the dimming is better but still not for gaming. The worst part of Q9FN is vertical banding. The panels screen uniformity vary quite a bit in the panel lottery and even if you get a good panel they virtually all suffer for banding in darker uniform scenes like panning over a dark evenly lit wall or even a bright sky for that matter. In my opinion form owning both, ZF9 is an amazing panel, if only for minor SDR and a bit worse HDR blooming it would have been the best all usages TV. The screen uniformity is REALLY good for a VA panel, even compared to am IPS. Some things like motion and backlight flicker, view angles and screen uniformity are really hard to perceive in a video review or through photos.

I shall be fair, if you are on a budget, if you only watch movies and don't feel you have a discerning eyes and blacks and blooming take priority over everything else then Q9 may be an option. But as picky as I am, a graphics/motion artist for over 20 years and play fighting games on a high level, it took me a couple of days of usage and some test footage to finally home in properly on all the flaws Q9 has so you won't necessarily be bothered by them as I am. Still I just felt so much relief when I laid my eyes on the ZF9, the screen and motion just is that much cleaner and more stable. Keep in mind that only in Q9's movie mode does the backlight flicker at 480hz else the rate of 120hz does feel a tad flickery to look at next to the very calm and stable image of ZF9.

Brightness wise, I think ZF9 is equal to or brighter over all but Q9FN can produce a bit more intensity in very small highlights. Still the difference is minor and the other image qualities like view angles and dark detail handling are bad on Q9 whilst great on the ZF9. The only TV personally see as an alternative is Q900 or an OLED, not Q9. I would only consider Q9 for a vert low price. Still I would only buy the 75ZF9 at or below $4500 as the blacks aren't as good as on the ZD9.
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post #4576 of 4724 Old 01-05-2019, 06:30 PM
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Official Sony Master Series Z9F 75/65” Owners Thread (2018/2019)

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Originally Posted by JoelArt View Post
It's very important to understand that most videos and photos including the youtube one exaggerates blooming and black levels. I doesn't look nearly as bad in real life. Yes Q9FN has good black but they are achieved at the expense of image accuracy due to overly aggressive dimming, if you manage to enable Cal Day/Night through the Service menu and/or have it professionally calibrated I believe the dimming is better but still not for gaming. The worst part of Q9FN is vertical banding. The panels screen uniformity vary quite a bit in the panel lottery and even if you get a good panel they virtually all suffer for banding in darker uniform scenes like panning over a dark evenly lit wall or even a bright sky for that matter. In my opinion form owning both, ZF9 is an amazing panel, if only for minor SDR and a bit worse HDR blooming it would have been the best all usages TV. The screen uniformity is REALLY good for a VA panel, even compared to am IPS. Some things like motion and backlight flicker, view angles and screen uniformity are really hard to perceive in a video review or through photos.



I shall be fair, if you are on a budget, if you only watch movies and don't feel you have a discerning eyes and blacks and blooming take priority over everything else then Q9 may be an option. But as picky as I am, a graphics/motion artist for over 20 years and play fighting games on a high level, it took me a couple of days of usage and some test footage to finally home in properly on all the flaws Q9 has so you won't necessarily be bothered by them as I am. Still I just felt so much relief when I laid my eyes on the ZF9, the screen and motion just is that much cleaner and more stable. Keep in mind that only in Q9's movie mode does the backlight flicker at 480hz else the rate of 120hz does feel a tad flickery to look at next to the very calm and stable image of ZF9.



Brightness wise, I think ZF9 is equal to or brighter over all but Q9FN can produce a bit more intensity in very small highlights. Still the difference is minor and the other image qualities like view angles and dark detail handling are bad on Q9 whilst great on the ZF9. The only TV personally see as an alternative is Q900 or an OLED, not Q9. I would only consider Q9 for a vert low price. Still I would only buy the 75ZF9 at or below $4500 as the blacks aren't as good as on the ZD9.


We also don’t know how it was setup we for sure know the z9d looks better than the 930e and 940e as well as the q7

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post #4577 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 01:32 AM
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We also don’t know how it was setup we for sure know the z9d looks better than the 930e and 940e as well as the q7
Tonight I watched Journey to the South Pacific Imax Enhanced on my new, yet to be calibrated, z9f. If anyone has any doubts about the ability of this television to provide the most extraordinary picture, stunning in the depth and breadth of color and in the reproduction of detail, please get Journey and play it on a z9f at a friendly dealer. Later I watch Schindler's List in 4k Dolby Vision. The z9f, while maintaining the films grain, reproduced detail that gave this black and white film a vibrancy that I do not recall when I previously watched it on blu-ray. Spielberg's latest incarnation of his classic film makes it even more poignant, all captured magnificently on the z9f. I am not technically oriented. I follow this thread and its various view points with interest, having learned much from it. But, as in all cases, I let my eyes and ears form my taste and tell me what to think. I've seen the Q9FN and in my opinion, what it reproduces on its screen looks artificial when compared to the life-like reproductions of the z9f. I am sure the Samsung set is a very good one and for many, the differences between it and the z9f are few enough to make the choice between them a difficult decision. But as for me, I think the z9f wins hands down, and anyone contemplating buying one should go and view a z9f, taking some favorite source material that a kind dealer might let you play.
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post #4578 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 07:59 AM
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My wife and I are currently rewatching all the Marvel movies before Captain Marvel is in theaters. It's too bad that they aren't all available for purchase with HDR.
The first Avengers looked awesome and so did Guardians of the Galaxy 2 in DV-HDR. Greatly done.....


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Sony LCD Master Series Calibration Thread
My P75-C1 Calibration Settings (5.0.14.1).
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post #4579 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 08:18 AM
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Tonight I watched Journey to the South Pacific Imax Enhanced on my new, yet to be calibrated, z9f.
Based on your comments, I just ordered this disk, as well as A Beautiful Planet, IMAX Enhanced version. Now if you could just get your CalMAN license key, you should really be enjoying your new display!
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post #4580 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 09:54 AM
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I don't believe they are building any more Z9Ds after this last build anyway so whatever is out there is probably going to be the last.
I though that a while ago....lol

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Originally Posted by isingh View Post
So I am researching for a TV to buy in next month or so. I am kind of stuck Sony 75Z9D ( hard to find at good price) , 75Z9F or Samsung 75Q9FN. Did anyone consider these other two options before selecting Z9F? What were the reasons for your decision ?
Many talks about that, because those are the best sets made right now as far as LED. Remember one thing, the TV that suite's you may not suite someone else, there is no wrong answer. Buy what "you" like

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I believe they are coming out of Mexico.
Yes, most TV's are made in Mexico, cheap labor, no need for a boat to transport the gear.
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post #4581 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 10:13 AM
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tough call

Thanks Everyone for your input.

I guess I got in the market a bit late, and it's difficult to find Z9D. Online still listed around $4k.
The 75Q9FN can certainly be bought for around $3500, whereas the 75Z9F is still in $5-6k range. This more than $2000 difference is sort of the rate limiting step for me.

At times it is not easy to make a decision by watching some content in store, specific home settings can vary a lot. And based on that buying online at a cheaper price then finding out that it was not the best decision is not an easy one either But certainly this forum has been very helpful in past several years.
I am considering to wait for another month or so and see if the price difference shrinks between Q9FN and Z9F, if it does then I am likely pulling the trigger on Z9F :P





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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post
I though that a while ago....lol

Many talks about that, because those are the best sets made right now as far as LED. Remember one thing, the TV that suite's you may not suite someone else, there is no wrong answer. Buy what "you" like

Yes, most TV's are made in Mexico, cheap labor, no need for a boat to transport the gear.
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post #4582 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 12:03 PM
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Sad day for Kodi users.... Not allowed to be installed on Sony TVs. It's firmware blocked so I wonder if that includes side loading.

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post #4583 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Sad day for Kodi users.... Not allowed to be installed on Sony TVs. It's firmware blocked so I wonder if that includes side loading.

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Not allowed please elaborate.

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post #4584 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 01:48 PM
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Not allowed please elaborate.
Sony blocked the install... Even side loading it appears. Looks like there is a work around but a pain in the arse.

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post #4585 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
Sony blocked the install... Even side loading it appears. Looks like there is a work around but a pain in the arse.

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Interesting I have it on my z9d and X930D any idea why?

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post #4586 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 02:13 PM
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Interesting I have it on my z9d and X930D any idea why?
http://www.cordcuttersnews.com/sony...d-tv-products/


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post #4587 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by JoelArt View Post
In short. ZD9 is best for critical movie watching in all other areas the ZF9 is best, especially for Gaming/PC-Monitor and Sports.
I would have agreed 100% if not for the fact that Sony removed 60Hz BFI mode on the Z9F. In game mode, you can't use interpolation (it would cause too much lag anyway) and you're stuck with 120Hz image duplication and ghosting if you enable the Clearness control at all. As a result, you're stuck with poor ~300 lines of motion resolution when 60Hz console gaming. On the Z9D, at maximum Clearness setting in game mode, you get a dramatic improvement in motion resolution due to 60Hz BFI. I guess if you only game on PC and can maintain 120 fps in all games then it's less of an issue. Rtings BFI test perfectly illustrates the problem: Z9F vs. Z9D. Sometimes you gotta wonder what goes through Sony's head when they make these bizarre software setting decisions. Why not give people who are not bothered by 60Hz flicker a choice like they did on the Z9D?

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Originally Posted by isingh View Post
What do you guys think about the video posted for brightness comparison of several panels including q9f , Z9D etc.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zwb92Jxdhb0

I am not the expert, based on this video at least q9f appears better ?
That video demonstrates something I pointed out here a few days ago but nobody seemed to know what I was talking about. Both the Z9F and Z9D never turn off their LED backlights when there is any non-black pixels on the screen. Even the smallest bright object causes the entire panel to raise its black level over the entire surface. That minimum black level is much higher on the Z9F due to the lower native contrast. You can see in the video that only the Samsung completely turns off some of its zones. There are pros/cons to each approach. I prefer the Sony method overall because it reduced some of the artifacts of local dimming - visible zone boundaries, vignetting, unstable brightness fluctuations, shadow-detail crushing.

Too see what's really going on with these TV's it helps if you shield your eyes from the bright object with your hand, otherwise you can't really focus on the dark background. Check them yourself to see what you prefer.
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post #4588 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
http://www.cordcuttersnews.com/sony...d-tv-products/


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Thanks for the link I still have a Shield

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post #4589 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by shoman94 View Post
http://www.cordcuttersnews.com/sony...d-tv-products/


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I am using a vero 4k+ to as a source for all my Kodi needs.
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post #4590 of 4724 Old 01-06-2019, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
I would have agreed 100% if not for the fact that Sony removed 60Hz BFI mode on the Z9F. In game mode, you can't use interpolation (it would cause too much lag anyway) and you're stuck with 120Hz image duplication and ghosting if you enable the Clearness control at all. As a result, you're stuck with poor ~300 lines of motion resolution when 60Hz console gaming. On the Z9D, at maximum Clearness setting in game mode, you get a dramatic improvement in motion resolution due to 60Hz BFI. I guess if you only game on PC and can maintain 120 fps in all games then it's less of an issue. Rtings BFI test perfectly illustrates the problem: Z9F vs. Z9D. Sometimes you gotta wonder what goes through Sony's head when they make these bizarre software setting decisions. Why not give people who are not bothered by 60Hz flicker a choice like they did on the Z9D?
Okay, I'm mostly with you on this one but I think there are two reason for most manufacturers to often leave it out.
1. I too would have loved 60hz BFI. Yet when I had it on the Q9FN, and in this case it was bright enough to use with SDR stuff but too dim in HDR, it still flickered to a too tiresome degree that I simply opted not to use it most of the times.
2. The majority of games are played on consoles in regards to TVs, this is unfortunate as they rarely reach stable 60 fps and not even solid 30 fps, rendering 60fps BFI uselss in these cases, and 30fps BFI would just kill your eyes.
These are the two reasons I think mean that the BFI, no matter how awesome it is, will not be widely used and thus down prioritized. But again, I too think this should be well implemented and up to the user but I fear they spend the time and resources else where for good or for worse.

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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post
That video demonstrates something I pointed out here a few days ago but nobody seemed to know what I was talking about. Both the Z9F and Z9D never turn off their LED backlights when there is any non-black pixels on the screen. Even the smallest bright object causes the entire panel to raise its black level over the entire surface. That minimum black level is much higher on the Z9F due to the lower native contrast. You can see in the video that only the Samsung completely turns off some of its zones. There are pros/cons to each approach. I prefer the Sony method overall because it reduced some of the artifacts of local dimming - visible zone boundaries, vignetting, unstable brightness fluctuations, shadow-detail crushing.

Too see what's really going on with these TV's it helps if you shield your eyes from the bright object with your hand, otherwise you can't really focus on the dark background. Check them yourself to see what you prefer.
This is simply incorrect for the ZF9, I can't speak for ZD9 but I believe it to be the same in this regard: A full screen black image with one white pixel will only activate LED zones behind that pixel. You have to enable LD (Local Dimming) Medium or High though as Off or Low will yield the results you are referring to. This true for Game, Cinema and most other modes but in Graphics mode it's true that you never get a 100% black image regardless of LD level and the LEDs stay on at a pretty low state. This is to ensure the most accurate image possible at the expense of some black level. In the other modes small white objects, especially fast moving ones, may be overly dimmed against black backgrounds as black levels are prioritized.

Last edited by JoelArt; 01-06-2019 at 05:40 PM.
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